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FreeWave
The Jet Set
USA
438 Posts |
 Posted - 07/06/2005 : 11:26:44
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Poll Question:
When specifically did New Wave DIE? Vote and then write exactly why you picked the year you chose. 
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Edited by - on
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i_like_lectric_motors
Room at the Top
Vatican City
6268 Posts |
Posted - 07/06/2005 : 11:30:34
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| I'll vote for 1985. That crappy Bowling For Soup song is all the proof I need. |
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KYYX4ever
Room at the Top
4614 Posts |
Posted - 07/06/2005 : 11:31:44
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Late 1985 was when New Wave sort of faded out, IMO. To be specific, Pet Shop Boys' "West End Girls" was the last great NW song (we've discussed this before on a long-ago thread). '85 was really when the synthy heart of NW started to fade, and music was morphing into something else. There was still some amazing stuff, such as the Smiths, the Church, Echo, etc., but for me, the rise of "college radio" was instrumental in developing a newer, more textured richer sound that left behind the fresh, synthy, silly sounds of NW.
I miss it still.
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My Aural Stimulator
Room at the Top
2075 Posts |
Posted - 07/06/2005 : 11:50:57
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| 1985 had some gems, but 1986 started the decline. By the time '87 rolled around, it was all gone. |
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Bitter Almonds
Room at the Top
USA
3880 Posts |
Posted - 07/06/2005 : 11:52:50
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| It died at the end of 1984. I'd say 1984 was the year it died. 1985 offered nothing like the previous years. |
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Frau_Blucher
Room at the Top
9706 Posts |
Posted - 07/06/2005 : 11:57:47
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If you're talking "jumping the shark" like the other thread did, I'd say 84 - mostly dead but not dead like Billy Crystal would say. But "dead" is another matter. New Wave may have been weezing and gasping for it's last breath, but like I've mentioned elsewhere (apologies for repeating), 1988 actually saw a final frenzy of some cool tracks that felt very new wave to me:
The Promise - When In Rome
The Chameleons - Nathan's Phase
Camouflage - The Great Commandment
Morrissey - Everyday Is Like Sunday
Marc Almond - Tears Run Rings
Pet Shop Boys - Domino Dancing
The Go-Betweens - Streets of Your Town
The Church - Under the Milky Way
Concrete Blond - Joey
After this, I really didn't feel it anymore...I was running around aimlessly like on that "I can't taste my beer" commercial. |
Edited by - Frau_Blucher on 07/06/2005 12:07:46 |
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FreeWave
The Jet Set
USA
438 Posts |
Posted - 07/06/2005 : 13:39:03
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| I had to go with 88 myself. While it ran out of steam past 85 I thought the last few years still had enough material those last years to compensate for a lack of freshness. The sounds of 88 on sounds a lot different to me then the difference between the years before it. |
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DavidRavenMoon
Switchin' to Glide
USA
34 Posts |
Posted - 07/06/2005 : 13:39:53
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quote:
Originally posted by Blir
The Church - Under the Milky Way
What a great CD! I still listen to it often. |
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LovePlusOne
Personal Jesus
USA
198 Posts |
Posted - 07/06/2005 : 13:44:25
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quote:
Originally posted by Blir
If you're talking "jumping the shark" like the other thread did, I'd say 84 - mostly dead but not dead like Billy Crystal would say. But "dead" is another matter. New Wave may have been weezing and gasping for it's last breath, but like I've mentioned elsewhere (apologies for repeating), 1988 actually saw a final frenzy of some cool tracks that felt very new wave to me:
The Promise - When In Rome
The Chameleons - Nathan's Phase
Camouflage - The Great Commandment
Morrissey - Everyday Is Like Sunday
Marc Almond - Tears Run Rings
Pet Shop Boys - Domino Dancing
The Go-Betweens - Streets of Your Town
The Church - Under the Milky Way
Concrete Blond - Joey
After this, I really didn't feel it anymore...I was running around aimlessly like on that "I can't taste my beer" commercial.
that's so funny...I had the same thought. New Wave kinda died in the mid-80s, only to have a brief return at the end of the decade before being slayed once and for all by the...ughh...'90s. |
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Frank_Chickens
Room at the Top
United Kingdom
1611 Posts |
Posted - 07/06/2005 : 13:48:58
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For me, the last main year was 1985.
Sure 1986 had Sigue Sigue Sputnik, did anyone listen after the initial single? I know it's a cliche to say that all songs sound the same, but in their case it was TRUE.
Same lines, same drums, same everything, just different lyrics. And the adverts between the tracks on the first album didn't help matters.
For me, it all finally ended in 1990. Even though there were slim pickings, there were still enough gems to be had:
Cetu Javu - Situations & the first album
Camouflage
Kon Kan - I Beg Your Pardon. The first album was pretty nifty, shame about the second.
When in Rome - The Promise, shame about the album
Wax - Bridge To Your Heart
They Might Be Giants - Birdhouse in Your Soul and Flood, a great combination |
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WolverineSyr
Room at the Top
USA
5302 Posts |
Posted - 07/06/2005 : 13:51:51
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'85 for me. A lot of money had been pumped into the genre by the record companies, bands created for it, slicker videos created to showcase it.
The companies started to shun the bands that had any quirkiness or individuality - which is what the genre was all about to me. Mtv got a lot more selective, and started to diversify it's playlist. I can't remember the year that the original vj's quit - but that seemed like an end of an era to me also. I know Mtv wasn't what defined new wave, but it was a great doorway for people to explore all kinds of new bands & sounds.
To me, Til Tuesday's Voices Carry was one of the last great new wave lps.
Goth groups and bands like The Cult were getting a lot of club play and although it was new waveish...it was something else too. I don't know what that intermediate period was though. |
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barrisfan
Personal Jesus
USA
118 Posts |
Posted - 07/06/2005 : 17:43:30
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| i voted for 1984 because that was when the truly great new wave station in seattle went off the air...KYYX |
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NuWaveRx
Der Kommissar
1110 Posts |
Posted - 07/06/2005 : 17:49:59
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quote:
Originally posted by Frank_Chickens
For me, the last main year was 1985.
Sure 1986 had Sigue Sigue Sputnik, did anyone listen after the initial single? I know it's a cliche to say that all songs sound the same, but in their case it was TRUE.
Same lines, same drums, same everything, just different lyrics. And the adverts between the tracks on the first album didn't help matters.
For me, it all finally ended in 1990. Even though there were slim pickings, there were still enough gems to be had:
Cetu Javu - Situations & the first album
Camouflage
Kon Kan - I Beg Your Pardon. The first album was pretty nifty, shame about the second.
When in Rome - The Promise, shame about the album
Wax - Bridge To Your Heart
They Might Be Giants - Birdhouse in Your Soul and Flood, a great combination
Agree with you and Blir that a burst of "Classic" wave reappeared toward the end of the '80. I've always considered The Ocean Blue as kinda the last gasp band of classic NW (exempting all the Neo NW stuff today, of course) |
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react010
Personal Jesus
100 Posts |
Posted - 07/06/2005 : 17:53:54
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| As from 1985 a lot of New-Wave artists allready had 1 or 2 flop singles. So after that they started to lose their creativity and began to think of 'How to be more commercial' to keep up with the trends. For most New-Wave artists it just 'did not work' as they just made sloppy 'commercial' singles (& Albums) that did not score, and so New-Wave just 'died'..... |
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geoffolehane
Room at the Top
USA
833 Posts |
Posted - 07/06/2005 : 19:00:57
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| While there were still many gems in '85-86...I think it had definitely run its course by then. By '85-86 the focus was more on production rather than making good music. The image (hair, make-up, clothes) was definitely history by 1986 except for Sigue Sigue Sputnik as someone else mentioned... |
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react010
Personal Jesus
100 Posts |
Posted - 07/06/2005 : 19:06:01
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There were certainly a lot of gems in 85-86, i agree, but indeed it was more to do with the 'Wham' kinda thing...all good looks and not-so-good music. Btw: Sigue Sigue Sputnik....did they EVER make MUSIC ?? . Never impressed me, that's for sure !. |
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Bitter Almonds
Room at the Top
USA
3880 Posts |
Posted - 07/06/2005 : 19:21:41
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quote:
Originally posted by react010
There were certainly a lot of gems in 85-86, i agree, but indeed it was more to do with the 'Wham' kinda thing...all good looks and not-so-good music. Btw: Sigue Sigue Sputnik....did they EVER make MUSIC ??. Never impressed me, that's for sure !.
Haha. Yeah, all that band was was a broken keyboard and a pair of mesh stockings |
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hexicon
Room at the Top
USA
1272 Posts |
Posted - 07/06/2005 : 19:47:04
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| 1984, with release of "The Smiths." Don't get me wrong; I like the Smiths a lot. But to me it took things off in an entirely different direction, musically, lyrically, stylistically. |
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thefxc
The Jet Set
USA
356 Posts |
Posted - 07/06/2005 : 20:19:53
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1991.
Based on my belief that: a) late 80s college radio/alternative music was the natural progression of new wave, if not the real thing; b) Nirvana, grunge, the decline of US indie labels, and the appropriation of the term "alternative" by record company promo departments ended the party by the Fall of '91. |
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whistledog
The Jet Set
Canada
310 Posts |
Posted - 07/06/2005 : 20:34:31
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| I'd say around 1987. Seemed like around that time was when Hair Metal, Rap and Acid/House was breaking into the charts |
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react010
Personal Jesus
100 Posts |
Posted - 07/06/2005 : 20:47:53
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Don't you think that New-Wave ended long before 1991 ?.
Personally i think that New-Wave was long gone dead by 1991 (not music as such, but New-Wave, let's nog get confused here in this topic... 'alternative music' excists to this very day but we are talking about New-Wave here).
As for the Smiths... in my opinion they really grew as the years had gone by. The last Album they made 'Strangeways Here We Come' (1987) was Ab-Fab in my opinion, better then they had ever done before. But it WAS the end of an 'era' i reckon. So...i'll meet you halfway in this discussion, 1987 was really the end of New-Wave, after that Acid & Techno & House soon took over big-time. |
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British
Room at the Top
USA
1479 Posts |
Posted - 07/07/2005 : 06:16:51
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It seems to me Sigue Sigue Sputnik was 99% image + hype, 1% music.
And with that music, it was the same melody used over and over again. Love missle f1-11 and 21st century Boy sound the same, but with different lyrics. |
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dearly beloved
Personal Jesus
144 Posts |
Posted - 07/07/2005 : 07:35:07
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| I'm with '85. probably right at the end, cuz I do remember a few great singles around that Christmas. After that it was mostly newer bands poorly recycling and the originals running out of ideas...or maybe my tastes were just changing. |
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Frank_Chickens
Room at the Top
United Kingdom
1611 Posts |
Posted - 07/07/2005 : 10:19:53
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quote:
Originally posted by British
It seems to me Sigue Sigue Sputnik was 99% image + hype, 1% music.
And with that music, it was the same melody used over and over again. Love missle f1-11 and 21st century Boy sound the same, but with different lyrics.
You should of heard the rest of the first album...
Note how nobody since has been stupid enough to include adverts in between the tracks since.
Note that this post contains more notes than the first sorry album did. :/
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knowitallrecs
Personal Jesus
USA
200 Posts |
Posted - 07/07/2005 : 15:04:11
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New Wave never died; it simply evolved.
To say that it perished only gives validity to the claims of its critics, who falsely claimed that the genre had no longevity. I refuse to give them the satisfaction or bookmark the style's lifespan between the good and bad years of my life or when a particular "sound" from its variety of flavors disappeared from radio or MTV. New Wave icons such as Echo & the Bunnymen, Depeche Mode, Erasure, the Cure, Simple Minds, the Lotus Eaters, the Church, Lloyd Cole, the Ocean Blue, among numerous others, continued to release albums after any so-called expiration date. Furthermore, young groups like Mono In VCF, Rialto, Franz Ferdinand, Bloc Party, the Pin-Up Girls,
Kaiser Chiefs, and the Killers can be played alongside "Rock of the '80s" and fool numerous people who didn't know they were new acts. (And it does work, too.)
New Wave, like heavy metal and hip-hop, simply absorbed more textures as the years progressed, adopting the latest technology, instrumentation, and recording techniques.
Dead? Only in the minds of people who refuse to accept change.
Dead? Only in the minds of critics who hated it in the first place.
Dead? Only in the minds of record companies who never understood it and wanted the country to move on.
New Wave is alive and well.
Michael Sutton
Staff Writer: The All-Music Guide |
Edited by - knowitallrecs on 07/07/2005 15:05:19 |
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Shoyrtt
Room at the Top
Western Sahara
509 Posts |
Posted - 07/07/2005 : 15:08:22
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quote:
Originally posted by whistledog
I'd say around 1987. Seemed like around that time was when Hair Metal, Rap and Acid/House was breaking into the charts
X2 |
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Ollie Stench
Room at the Top
2562 Posts |
Posted - 07/07/2005 : 15:21:09
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Personally for me it was 1986. That's when rap took over, and all the creativity had been exhausted by the originators like The Clash, The Jam, DEVO, The B-52's, Eurythmics etc. (of course that's a blanket statement, please don't tear me a new one over it as there are many exceptions).
Duran Duran were the biggest mainstream band in the world, Live Aid had brought alot of underground bands up to the general public's attention.
Call it death or evolution, it just wasn't the same after early 1986. |
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dearly beloved
Personal Jesus
144 Posts |
Posted - 07/07/2005 : 19:30:15
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quote:
Originally posted by knowitallrecs
New Wave never died; it simply evolved.
To say that it perished only gives validity to the claims of its critics, who falsely claimed that the genre had no longevity. I refuse to give them the satisfaction or bookmark the style's lifespan between the good and bad years of my life or when a particular "sound" from its variety of flavors disappeared from radio or MTV. New Wave icons such as Echo & the Bunnymen, Depeche Mode, Erasure, the Cure, Simple Minds, the Lotus Eaters, the Church, Lloyd Cole, the Ocean Blue, among numerous others, continued to release albums after any so-called expiration date. Furthermore, young groups like Mono In VCF, Rialto, Franz Ferdinand, Bloc Party, the Pin-Up Girls,
Kaiser Chiefs, and the Killers can be played alongside "Rock of the '80s" and fool numerous people who didn't know they were new acts. (And it does work, too.)
New Wave, like heavy metal and hip-hop, simply absorbed more textures as the years progressed, adopting the latest technology, instrumentation, and recording techniques.
Dead? Only in the minds of people who refuse to accept change.
Dead? Only in the minds of critics who hated it in the first place.
Dead? Only in the minds of record companies who never understood it and wanted the country to move on.
New Wave is alive and well.
Michael Sutton
Staff Writer: The All-Music Guide
I can appreciate the tenets you employ in defense of the music we all love, knowitallrecs.
You're right that New Wave can never die in that there are forums like the NWOutpost and scads of young bands that (for the most part) adequately ape the genre. But yeah, the New Wave most of us knew some 20 odd years ago is dead. Not because it's a facet of modern music that had no depth, longevity or viability, but rather because all those original ideas and inspirations could only have happened at that time, demanding relevance, defining a generation as a reaction to things concurrent to that day.
Just as England's Punk movement was a reaction to stodgy old rock dinosaurs, or as grunge was a reaction to hair metal pretense.
As it's harshest critics blasted it as pre-packaged non-music, the joke was on them. New Wave could only have happened at the time that it did. It smeared lipstick on the dour countenenace of Post-Punk. It mirrored early eighties world excess and spat it right back in our faces. We loved NW for it....and still do.
Long live New Wave. |
Edited by - Panorama on 07/07/2005 19:54:59 |
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knowitallrecs
Personal Jesus
USA
200 Posts |
Posted - 07/07/2005 : 21:15:48
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quote:
Originally posted by dearly beloved
quote:
Originally posted by knowitallrecs
New Wave never died; it simply evolved.
To say that it perished only gives validity to the claims of its critics, who falsely claimed that the genre had no longevity. I refuse to give them the satisfaction or bookmark the style's lifespan between the good and bad years of my life or when a particular "sound" from its variety of flavors disappeared from radio or MTV. New Wave icons such as Echo & the Bunnymen, Depeche Mode, Erasure, the Cure, Simple Minds, the Lotus Eaters, the Church, Lloyd Cole, the Ocean Blue, among numerous others, continued to release albums after any so-called expiration date. Furthermore, young groups like Mono In VCF, Rialto, Franz Ferdinand, Bloc Party, the Pin-Up Girls,
Kaiser Chiefs, and the Killers can be played alongside "Rock of the '80s" and fool numerous people who didn't know they were new acts. (And it does work, too.)
New Wave, like heavy metal and hip-hop, simply absorbed more textures as the years progressed, adopting the latest technology, instrumentation, and recording techniques.
Dead? Only in the minds of people who refuse to accept change.
Dead? Only in the minds of critics who hated it in the first place.
Dead? Only in the minds of record companies who never understood it and wanted the country to move on.
New Wave is alive and well.
Michael Sutton
Staff Writer: The All-Music Guide
I can appreciate the tenets you employ in defense of the music we all love, knowitallrecs.
You're right that New Wave can never die in that there are forums like the NWOutpost and scads of young bands that (for the most part) adequately ape the genre. But yeah, the New Wave most of us knew some 20 odd years ago is dead. Not because it's a facet of modern music that had no depth, longevity or viability, but rather because all those original ideas and inspirations could only have happened at that time, demanding relevance, defining a generation as a reaction to things concurrent to that day.
Just as England's Punk movement was a reaction to stodgy old rock dinosaurs, or as grunge was a reaction to hair metal pretense.
As it's harshest critics blasted it as pre-packaged non-music, the joke was on them. New Wave could only have happened at the time that it did. It smeared lipstick on the dour countenenace of Post-Punk. It mirrored early eighties world excess and spat it right back in our faces. We loved NW for it....and still do.
Long live New Wave.
But wasn't the whole point of New Wave was to be progressive? To say that the genre only existed within a period of time, to me, goes against the genre's original purpose - to look into the future instead of being shackled by the past. It was supposed to evolve and not remain the same. Of course, New Wave in 2005 is not going to sound like New Wave in 1980. Your argument is well articulated, but I refuse to believe that New Wave could've only happened during a specific period. History repeats itself, socially and politically, and youths have an inherent need to rebel and discover their own individuality. Franz Ferdinand, the Pin-Up Girls, and Bloc Party are providing the same "fuck you" statements to rap-metal and corporate slush that Depeche Mode, Echo & the Bunnymen, and the Cure did in the '80s. You can look at New Wave as a cultural phenomenon that lasted from the late '70s to the early '80s, but there's dramatic stylistic growth in those years, too. The New Wave of 1977 was radically different from the New Wave of 1982. Shouldn't the New Wave of 1982 not be called New Wave then since it wasn't the same as the New Wave of 1977, which was more punk and certainly nowhere near as synth-based? If you look at it objectively instead of, "Oh, it ended in 1983 because I didn't like how it sounded anymore," you will see that the evolution of the genre had been in place the whole time and continued to the present time. To me, New Wave is an artform and not an artifact. I find it ironic that many people consider the lifespan of New Wave defined by the years of its most commercial success, the very thing that the genre was supposed to be against. (In the Philippines, New Wave didn't fade in popularity until 1991 when grunge and finally metal invaded. We never understood why American radio was hardly playing it anymore by the mid-'80s when we had three New Wave radio stations to choose from.) If New Wave was supposed to be an underground movement, then how did it die if it merely crawled back beyond mainstream consciousness?
Michael Sutton
Staff Writer: The All-Music Guide |
Edited by - knowitallrecs on 07/07/2005 21:20:39 |
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hexicon
Room at the Top
USA
1272 Posts |
Posted - 07/07/2005 : 21:38:58
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quote:
Originally posted by barrisfan
i voted for 1984 because that was when the truly great new wave station in seattle went off the air...KYYX
To make a different point than Knowitallrecs, I'm with Barrisfan. At a very personal level, that's when it ended for me. The Smiths' first US release and the end of KYYX roughly coincided with the spring of 1984, and my high school graduation, and nothing was the same after that. Easy living, nightlife, ephemeral dance tunes by Tin Tin and Cee Farrow--for me, it was all wiped away by college, financial demands, and the guitar-driven angst of the Smiths, even though Pet Shop Boys, Erasure, and Echo & Bunnymen had great NW releases in 1986 and 87.
I agree that--objectively speaking--New Wave mutated, evolved, and adapted, and its continuity can be traced both directly and by influence. But for me, New Wave was an experience, a mind-set, and a nightlifestyle as well as a musical style and it all ended in 1984. |
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dearly beloved
Personal Jesus
144 Posts |
Posted - 07/08/2005 : 08:31:03
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At the base of it, it seems like we have the same ideas of it's cultural relevance and importance, which is ultimately what counts.
Your points are well put and well taken.
"Agree to disagree." -Ron Burgundy: Anchorman |
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waukena
Room at the Top
Burundi
1363 Posts |
Posted - 07/08/2005 : 09:12:54
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I gotta agree with Hex and the 84/85 bunch...I'm 44 and worked in a bunch of punk clubs that then became NW clubs and it was about that time that the feel changed...
I don't think it had anything to do with the art or airplay or commercial success...I think the scene just got mainstream, overexposed and ultimately tired...
figure if you came on the scene in 79 or 80, it was already pushing 5 years. The initial wave of kids who were into it were growing older, like Hex said...for me, college was over and the real world came in...but more than that, like I said before, the club scene felt different...maybe it was just me but I don't think so because I've had this discussion with a bunch of my old time cohorts...
I worked the clubs til 91 or so, but they never seemed to have the urgency they did in the late 70s/ early 80s...the music was there but the revolution had passed by...the original punk/NW clubs were kind of a place for misfits, people who didn't quite fit into other places...I was that way, as were all of my friends...by 84, NW was 'the' scene, and therefore could no longer be the fringe culture it began as...once a fringe culture or anything becomes mainstream, those misfits who originally were the core group of it are now on the outside once again...it inevitably gets watered down as a whole, and I think that's what happened...
Just my feelings... |
Edited by - on 07/08/2005 09:14:15 |
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2Nu
Room at the Top
2968 Posts |
Posted - 07/08/2005 : 09:37:49
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New Wave Died for me on that fateful November day in 1987 when WLIR abruptly went off the air (To the tune 'All the Good Times We Had We'll Have Again)
The airwaves fell silent for a what seemed an eternity (with the exception of some bizzare broadcasted folk styled music)
When much heralded broadcast came back on trumpeting the new call letters WDRE (dubya-derr IMO)
Somehow the pioneering college radio spirit of the station had suddenly evaporated and the 'new' station was just a lame commercialized retread that chose to ride on the NW coattails of the peerless original. |
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middlesexnj
Room at the Top
Saint Helena
527 Posts |
Posted - 07/08/2005 : 10:11:13
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| I admit NW was in decline from '85 on, but I would say the casket was closed until '89. |
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phillyidol
Room at the Top
USA
7854 Posts |
Posted - 07/08/2005 : 11:47:12
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| The day Gino Vinnelli hung up his microphone was the day the music died. |
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My Aural Stimulator
Room at the Top
2075 Posts |
Posted - 07/08/2005 : 12:13:59
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quote:
Originally posted by phillyidol
The day Gino Vinnelli hung up his microphone was the day the music died.
Bring it back, Gino! Somebody should do a "Hooked On Gino Vanelli" medley. |
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Frau_Blucher
Room at the Top
9706 Posts |
Posted - 07/08/2005 : 12:33:44
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quote:
Originally posted by waukena
Just my feelings...
Wow, everything you said feels really right-on Wauk! That really put a wrapper on it for me. Now, Knowitallrec's feel's really right-on as well, but you gotta draw a line somewhere. "Time" really is an important component - the time from when new wave was coined and self-recognized ('76?) to when that specific movement dissovled. Otherwise, you're gonna end up saying that anything that was pop, counter-cultural, progressive, and creative can be considered new wave...but it isn't. It doesn't fit into that TIME. The other stuff is "next wave" or whatever other kind of alterno. Otherwise, Bill Haley's "Rock Around the Clock", which was also all of the above descriptions (* and whose presence on the top of the pop charts 50 years ago today marked the start of rock and roll! *), is new wave too...but he isn't. |
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fortyfives
Personal Jesus
USA
170 Posts |
Posted - 07/08/2005 : 12:37:58
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1983 was definitely the peak for New Wave - especially from a commercial aspect. I can remember top 40 radio actually being fun to listen to. 1984 was also a good year, but not quite as good as '83. New Wave was on the decline bigtime by 1985, even though there were still some gems being released , the glory days were fast coming to a close. There were even a few gems still coming out as late as '88 and '89 , but they were few and far between.
I know alot of you are going to disagree with me, but I loathe everything U2 released from the "Joshua Tree" and after. Boy and October were fantastic Lp's. War was also a fine Lp. I thought the Unforgettable Fire was spotty at best. I can remember all the anticipation building up for the release of the Joshua Tree, and how when I first heard it I couldn't beleive U2 had recorded such crap! I always viewed this Lp as a "sell-out" as it also turned out to be the beginning of them becoming tremendously successful.
The same goes for REM. When I first heard Chronic Town and Murmur (back in '83), I was completely blown away . Reckoning and Fables of the Reconstruction were also great Lp's. Life's Rich Pageant, Document, and even Green were not bad Lp's, but they all lacked something the first four lp's had. When Out of Time was released, for me, it was like "Joshua Tree" all over again. I could less for anything REM has released from that Lp onward.
Anyone agree or disagree?
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KYYX4ever
Room at the Top
4614 Posts |
Posted - 07/08/2005 : 12:57:38
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| I agree with you about REM. Fables of.. was a great album. Reckoning was, IMO, their best. It's one of those albums I can listen to every track w/ out fast forwarding anything. Some songs off Document and Life's... were great, but not as cool and titillating as their 1st 4 albums. |
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waldnorm
Room at the Top
1045 Posts |
Posted - 07/08/2005 : 17:37:28
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80's Alternative music is supposed to have "died" with Nirvana's "Smells Like Teen Spirit" (1991)-- given that, 1985 is the year where new wave seemed to wane as a predominant force as the so-called "Power" dance tunes, glam rock (i.e. spandex, etc.) and 80's rap took over. New wave became passe as a term and thus, we called it all "modern rock" or "alternative". By the 90's, many of the "pop" type of new wave has been called "synthpop."
So take your pick.
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ghosty
Room at the Top
USA
1600 Posts |
Posted - 07/08/2005 : 20:29:47
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quote:
Originally posted by 2Nu
New Wave Died for me on that fateful November day in 1987 when WLIR abruptly went off the air (To the tune 'All the Good Times We Had We'll Have Again)
The airwaves fell silent for a what seemed an eternity (with the exception of some bizzare broadcasted folk styled music)
When much heralded broadcast came back on trumpeting the new call letters WDRE (dubya-derr IMO)
Somehow the pioneering college radio spirit of the station had suddenly evaporated and the 'new' station was just a lame commercialized retread that chose to ride on the NW coattails of the peerless original.
Man, it's ALL age related!! When I was in high school it was ALL about WDRE. We thought it was the coolest thing going and listened religiously (The Cure, The Smiths, Cocteau Twins etc).
Had we been born 4 years earlier we would've been listening to WLIR. Everything changes, teenagers become middle aged, and styles of music and come and go. Just life. |
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knowitallrecs
Personal Jesus
USA
200 Posts |
Posted - 07/09/2005 : 10:00:27
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Some of my favorite New Wave records - albums from the Chameleons, the Mission UK, Fra Lippo Lippi, the Wild Swans, the Close Lobsters, the Mighty Lemon Drops, the Adventures, Thrashing Doves, the Railway Children, the Go-Betweens, the Sun and the Moon, 1927, etc - came out between 1986-1988 so the idea of the genre losing steam by the early '80s simply doesn't register. The Philippines didn't get an all-New Wave station really until the legendary XB-102 in 1984, and in 1987 NU-107 and BM-105 were fighting it out. Incredible time.
Michael Sutton |
Edited by - knowitallrecs on 07/09/2005 13:30:34 |
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react010
Personal Jesus
100 Posts |
Posted - 07/09/2005 : 10:15:27
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| Maybe we are mixing things up a little in this topic... New-Wave artists didn't all stop making music in the mid 80's, and even to this day NW artists are still releasing stuff off course, so it didn't really die. But commercially (for me the european charts) it was mostly over by 1986. |
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Frau_Blucher
Room at the Top
9706 Posts |
Posted - 07/09/2005 : 10:34:18
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quote:
Originally posted by Cured
1981 Mtv begins. New Wave gradually becomes more lame, and consequently a bigger part of pop culture.
1982 WLIR switches format(The previous wlir did a much better job with new wave music), throngs of "Lawn Guylenders" suddenly become cutting edge New Wavers, daring to be different by copying exactly what everyone else "daring to be different" was doing.
198? Some of the frequent posters to this board discover New Wave.
Grunch, you are hilarious! |
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ghosty
Room at the Top
USA
1600 Posts |
Posted - 07/09/2005 : 16:57:04
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quote:
Originally posted by Blir
quote:
Originally posted by Cured
1981 Mtv begins. New Wave gradually becomes more lame, and consequently a bigger part of pop culture.
1982 WLIR switches format(The previous wlir did a much better job with new wave music), throngs of "Lawn Guylenders" suddenly become cutting edge New Wavers, daring to be different by copying exactly what everyone else "daring to be different" was doing.
198? Some of the frequent posters to this board discover New Wave.
Grunch, you are hilarious!
Hey Grunch,
What was I supposed to do? I was only 9 when New Wave hit! |
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korova1
Personal Jesus
240 Posts |
Posted - 07/09/2005 : 19:38:09
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Here we are at home watching our 16 month old and he is taking a nap so I will write something quickly so bear with me... I'd agree, mid 80's was the end of the genre as a whole. For me, I always had a side interest in punk and harder edged stuff so I would be guessing as to the actual year New Wave croaked, but I'd say the good New Wave disappeared or became bloated and caved in on itself in 1986 - mid 87. By 1988 and Ministry's "Land of Rape and Honey", new wave was completely R.I.P. for me.
In my opinion, most of the early 80's New Wavers either got extremely popular on crappy albums after that, and/or then they cashed in on the craze (Simple Minds, Billy Idol, Talking Heads, Psyche Furs, Flock of Seagulls, Spandau Ballet, OMD, INXS, Violent Femmes, Thompson Twins, Duran Duran split into camps, etc.,). Then all the new marketed commercial new wave bands all began to really SUCK, nobody bought it and the scene died off in late 87. OVERPRODUCTION was quite popular at the time, but not with me!!! Really shitty songs started to creep into mainstream playlists, giving New Wave a bad name for everyone. "Everybody Wang Chung Tonight" or "Some Like It Hot" anyone??
Where I lived darker was considered better. Bauhaus and Joy Division (both of which I'd heard of long after they were defunct)were gathering alot of re-interest from the DJ's on college radio... and the club playlists started to get alot darker around this time. To give perspective on the times changing, looking at a high school dance playlist we DJ'ed in 1986 we played "Nemesis", "Dig It", "She Sells Sanctuary", "Temple Of Love", "Let's Go To Bed", "Love Will Tear Us Apart", "Everyday is Halloween", "World Destruction", "Love Missile F-111 (or whatver it is)", and a bunch of other poppier stuff from Echo, Adam Ant, etc... Industrial was becoming more and more popular underground and I think it had alot to do with the end of the happier, poppier New Wave music. If I remember correctly 86-87 is the dividing-line year for alot of new wavers, they either liked the new over produced poppy stuff that was coming out in droves or they hated it and liked the harder edged stuff. I was starting to hate what was once called "New Wave", it just didn't evolve very well, and during that time if it went mainstream I hated it. So with electronic music I drew the line at Men Without Hats and started checking out Cabaret Voltaire, and Neubauten.
Most people's tastes began to change around 1986, either with Rap, hair bands, or harder edged music. I went back to the latter considering Sonic Youth, Love and Rockets, Jesus and Mary Chain, and Husker Du were making killer albums during those years and the New Wavers weren't!!! There was also alot of people getting more interested in the Velvet Underground at this time, "VU" was released and it started a whole new interest in that band. It was kind of bittersweet for me because after hearing "Hatful of Hollow", "Let It Be", "Psychocandy" and "EVOL" I knew that music was changing in a big big way because there was alot of killer stuff coming out in England and indie U.S. scenes. I truly missed the old days (in the earlier 80's) when my older brother would bring home the latest U2, OMD, New Order, or Duran 12 inch single because that stuff meant so much to me growing up, but I started going further and further underground around this time for stuff to listen to. Then I fell in love with probably my all time favorite band Sonic Youth around this time!!!
I remember The Cure, Depeche, Siouxsie, Echo, and New Order (God how I love them) were extremely reliable around this time and saw them all in concert in the summer of 1987... they were the last of the big New Waver's to stand true to the end of the 80's... (if you consider them NW!) Most of them were just starting to get popular in 1986 with most of the kiddies. 1987 was the end of really GOOD consisten New Wave music for me... and when U2 took over Springsteen's job (making stadium friendly "American" music, which was a HUGE disappointment for me) and REM started to suck around that time... I personally hate REM's "Document" with a passion (but I also hate "Joshua Tree") I started to look elsewhere. Please put on "Lightning Hopkins" or "Fireplace" on Side 2 of "Document" and tell me that album is rock solid!!! I guess I've just grown to hate over-production, probably because of 1987.
Anyway, I am getting off the path, when Run DMC put out the ground breaking "Raising Hell" album... and the Beasties came along, it was another nail in the coffin for the New Wave artists and their kin.... I might have picked up a few NW-related releases in the late 80's but it just wasn't the same. Figures on the Beach? c'mon! I can probably count the good NW related stuff on two hands after 1987. After mid 80's the music was all over the place and mainstream MTV culture went towards mainstream music, rap, and the hair bands! (Hey, didn't Gene Love Jezebel and the Cult become one of them?) Whooo!!! As for me, there were never better years than 1980-86 for sheer quality and variety in music (why would I be on this post if it wasn't?), but as usual, music scenes only last that long or less, then things change.... Well, my kid is up - hope I made sense, I was writing in a hurry, now I gots to run! |
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react010
Personal Jesus
100 Posts |
Posted - 07/09/2005 : 20:37:03
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Great reply korova1 !! It sums it all up i think...(and believe me, it didn't seem like you wrote this in a hurry).
Personally i sometimes DO like over-production if it is done well, for example Marc Almond's (Soft-Cell) "Enchanted" album was totally over-produced, but it's one of my all time favorite albums (amongst the other 1000 or so). For me the end of New-Wave was around the time when Siouxsie & The Banshees released "Kiss Them For me" as a single. Totally loved that track to death, but whem it didn't do well in the charts...for me that was a kinda 'this is the end' feeling. |
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KYYX4ever
Room at the Top
4614 Posts |
Posted - 07/09/2005 : 20:39:07
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quote:
Originally posted by korova1
OVERPRODUCTION was quite popular at the time, but not with me!!! Really shitty songs started to creep into mainstream playlists, giving New Wave a bad name for everyone. "Some Like It Hot" anyone??
&
Industrial was becoming more and more popular underground and I think it had alot to do with the end of the happier, poppier New Wave music. If I remember correctly 86-87 is the dividing-line year for alot of new wavers, they either liked the new over produced poppy stuff that was coming out in droves or they hated it and liked the harder edged stuff.
that's what happened to me.
I started college in late summer of '86, and to me, even tho I still listened to a lot of my old New Wave, it had died by then. One thing that was coming down the turnpike that I loved was early Industrial....Skinny Puppy, Severed Heads, Neubaten, etc. (Not Ministry, tho; couldn't stand their new sound...blech!). Anyway, your point resonated with me. In '86, music got to be REALLY overproduced and that was a big turn-off, to me.
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react010
Personal Jesus
100 Posts |
Posted - 07/09/2005 : 21:11:10
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Great reply korova1 !! It sums it all up i think...(and believe me, it didn't seem like you wrote this in a hurry).
Personally i sometimes DO like over-production if it is done well, for example Marc Almond's (Soft-Cell) "Enchanted" album was totally over-produced, but it's one of my all time favorite albums (amongst the other 1000 or so). For me the end of New-Wave was around the time when Siouxsie & The Banshees released "Kiss Them For me" as a single. Totally loved that track to death, but whem it didn't do well in the charts...for me that was a kinda 'this is the end' feeling. |
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react010
Personal Jesus
100 Posts |
Posted - 07/09/2005 : 21:15:49
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| Sorry for the double post, sometimes when you hit the back button your post to a topic reloads and posts a second time. |
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newwavepopman
Room at the Top
590 Posts |
Posted - 07/10/2005 : 23:30:09
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I voted on the year 1991 because right after 1991 MTV stopped showing music videos by artists that were still recording New Wave music,and also because that was the year that most radio stations that had a 24 hour New Wave format such as WLIR-WDRE completely changed their format to what I call the worst piece of music in the history of rock and roll,that being Grunge and Alternative.Right before 1992 ended,I stopped hearing alot of synthpop and started hearing more and more of those noise Grunge and Alternative acts on the radio like Nirvana,and whoever else was starting to make an impact back at that time.
After then music was just never the same again. |
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Topic |
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When did New Wave DIE?
