New Wave Outpost Forum

The Killers, Franz Ferdinand, British Sea Power, VHS or Beta, Dogs Die in Hot Cars, et al. seem to me to be guitar pop with as much in common with 90's alternative as with late 70's-early 80's new wave. I haven't listened to any of the aboves' complete catalogs - this is admittedly based on a brief sampling.

With The Epoxies, Freezepop, Goldfrapp, Soviet, & The Bravery it seems much more obvious.

Is every guitar pop band that's, to varying degrees, catchy, melodic, quirky or experimental classified as Next Wave? Does putting in a few synth effects do it?

I've exposed my ignorance here. What am I missing? Point me to some of their songs and tell me what's new-wavish about them.

They're about as "New Wave" as The Cars and Elvis Costello are New Wave. In retrospect, guitar-driven Pop was sometimes lumped in with SynthPop and Futurist into New Wave.

I'm guessing they're Next Wave because it's hooky alternative pop rock that's off the norm of either pure radio crap pop or standard alterno hard rock. New wave was orginially similar in spirit when the term was coined in the mid-late 70s in NYC for that crop of bands going thru CBGBs and Max's Kansas City and later applied to the skinnytie bands, etc. The synthpop stuff that later got thrown in with new wave, and admittedly came to dominate the perception of what new wave was, came later IMHO but is also certainly no less a part of new wave. So yeah, I think these new bands fit that alternative pop rock label. Some guitar, some synths thrown in, some style, etc. Maybe only lacking in experimentation, although it's more experimental than the other crap out there.

BTW, no one within 100 miles of me in SoCal from 1975 to 1985 EVER uttered the word "futurist" in relation to any new wave that we listened back then! And yeah, The Cars and Elvis were new wave. If you don't think so, you either weren't there, don't understand the context of the music at that time, or just plain forgot. It's revisionist BS to think they weren't new wave.

Holy shit it's a small world. Just browsing some bands in Amazon and I peep one of those lists in the side column. One's called "Best of Next Wave". 'Interesting' I think, probably crap. But I take a look and see who's the author! And it's an awesome list!!

http://www.amazon.com/gp/richpub/listma ... oding=UTF8

[quote][i]Originally posted by Blir[/i]
<br>I'm guessing they're Next Wave because it's hooky alternative pop rock that's off the norm of either pure radio crap pop or standard alterno hard rock. New wave was orginially similar in spirit when the term was coined in the mid-late 70s in NYC for that crop of bands going thru CBGBs and Max's Kansas City and later applied to the skinnytie bands, etc. The synthpop stuff that later got thrown in with new wave, and admittedly came to dominate the perception of what new wave was, came later IMHO but is also certainly no less a part of new wave. So yeah, I think these new bands fit that alternative pop rock label. Some guitar, some synths thrown in, some style, etc. Maybe only lacking in experimentation, although it's more experimental than the other crap out there.

BTW, no one within 100 miles of me in SoCal from 1975 to 1985 EVER uttered the word "futurist" in relation to any new wave that we listened back then! And yeah, The Cars and Elvis were new wave. If you don't think so, you either weren't there, don't understand the context of the music at that time, or just plain forgot. It's revisionist BS to think they weren't new wave.
[/quote]

I used the word "Futurist" in reference to Steve Strange, who said New Romantic and SynthPop music of the time sounded "Futuristic"[8D]

http://www.globaldarkness.com/articles/visage.htm

AAAHH!!! Jesus XXX! You trying to scare the crap outta me with that Steve Strange picture?! [:D]

Haha. Actually, I always thought he was a much better looking [i]persona rara[/i] than Boy George, but not something I'd wanna do myself[:I] The vid for [i]Fade To Gray[/i] is a classic.

Btw, I bookmarked that Amazon list[:D]

[quote]Originally posted by scramjet
[br]The Killers, Franz Ferdinand, British Sea Power, VHS or Beta, Dogs Die in Hot Cars, et al. seem to me to be guitar pop with as much in common with 90's alternative as with late 70's-early 80's new wave. I haven't listened to any of the aboves' complete catalogs - this is admittedly based on a brief sampling.

With The Epoxies, Freezepop, Goldfrapp, Soviet, & The Bravery it seems much more obvious.

Is every guitar pop band that's, to varying degrees, catchy, melodic, quirky or experimental classified as Next Wave? Does putting in a few synth effects do it?

I've exposed my ignorance here. What am I missing? Point me to some of their songs and tell me what's new-wavish about them.


[/quote]

Let's see...

use of synthesizers, otherwordly, isolated themes set to catchy melodies, somewhat sexally ambiguous look (including makeup from the Duran Duran playbook). The fun sound of disco mixed with the angst of punk. And a healthy dose of irreverence. That's important. Rock in the 90's lost it's sense of humor and took itself way too seriously.

Guitars, yes. But not grungy, thrash "Wall Of Guitars". Or testosterone overdosed vocals.

Even the way they dress. Franz Ferdinand and Killers are wearing skinny ties and the other stuff I threw out in 1986. Knew I should have kept that Members Only jacket!

Believe it or not there was a music movement called "futurist" back in the 30's and 40's. It went hand in hand with the short-lived Art movement around at the same time. I have a CD of some of it. Scratchy old 78's transferred to CD of guys warbling nonsense and screaming while someone beats on various percussion. Actually it sounds a lot like latter-day Peter Gabriel.[:D]

[quote][i]Originally posted by ghosty[/i]
<br>Believe it or not there was a music movement called "futurist" back in the 30's and 40's. It went hand in hand with the short-lived Art movement around at the same time. I have a CD of some of it. Scratchy old 78's transferred to CD of guys warbling nonsense and screaming while someone beats on various percussion. Actually it sounds a lot like latter-day Peter Gabriel.[:D]


[/quote]

Try for 10s and 20s[8D] The Italians wrote Futurist manifestos around those times... too bad they were all Fascists[}:)]

Would you say some of that Throbbing Gristle, Neu!, and Suicide sound a bit like those screams with the sound of droning airplane engines that came from the 40s and 50s?

[quote]Originally posted by scramjet
[br]The Killers, Franz Ferdinand, British Sea Power, VHS or Beta, Dogs Die in Hot Cars, et al. seem to me to be guitar pop with as much in common with 90's alternative as with late 70's-early 80's new wave. I haven't listened to any of the aboves' complete catalogs - this is admittedly based on a brief sampling.

With The Epoxies, Freezepop, Goldfrapp, Soviet, & The Bravery it seems much more obvious.[quote]


Hey Scramjet, Here is a question for you:

What specifically makes The Bravery a "more obvious" Next Wave band than The Killers, Franz Ferdinand, etc.? How would YOU describe the difference?

[quote][i]Originally posted by djcraig[/i]
Hey Scramjet, Here is a question for you:

What specifically makes The Bravery a "more obvious" Next Wave band than The Killers, Franz Ferdinand, etc.? How would YOU describe the difference?
[/quote]

I'll admit it's pretty subjective, but the first time I heard "An Honest Mistake" I thought, "These guys have been listening to The Cure and New Order". The new wave influence just doen't jump out at me as much for The Killers and FF. Which isn't to say I don't like them. It just seems to me that the new wave influence is more subtle.

I guess I'm the only who noticed that the lead singer of The Bravery bears a bit of a resemblance to Morrissey in their first music vid. I know there's another band out there who has a lead singer that resembles Morrissey, but I ferget which one... it's not New New Wave, though.

[quote][i]Originally posted by Blir[/i]
<br>Holy shit it's a small world. Just browsing some bands in Amazon and I peep one of those lists in the side column. One's called "Best of Next Wave". 'Interesting' I think, probably crap. But I take a look and see who's the author! And it's an awesome list!!

http://www.amazon.com/gp/richpub/listma ... oding=UTF8
[/quote]

Heya Blir~

That's my list - lol! There's a part two that I've made on Amazon too - check it out!

Tess[8D]

------------------------

Tess's Indie-Wave:

http://www.live365.com/stations/horrorfreak13

[quote][i]Originally posted by XXX[/i]
<br>[quote][i]Originally posted by ghosty[/i]
<br>Believe it or not there was a music movement called "futurist" back in the 30's and 40's. It went hand in hand with the short-lived Art movement around at the same time. I have a CD of some of it. Scratchy old 78's transferred to CD of guys warbling nonsense and screaming while someone beats on various percussion. Actually it sounds a lot like latter-day Peter Gabriel.[:D]


[/quote]

Try for 10s and 20s[8D] The Italians wrote Futurist manifestos around those times... too bad they were all Fascists[}:)]

Would you say some of that Throbbing Gristle, Neu!, and Suicide sound a bit like those screams with the sound of droning airplane engines that came from the 40s and 50s?


[/quote]

I stand corrected. I should have looked at the CD. It says "Futurist And Dada". I know the DaDa movement was from back then. Ever watch the PBS series "The Surreal Eye"? Late 80's. Showed all those Dali and Bunuel films.

Yeah, Throbbing Gristle is more like it although TG is actually more tuneful and structured.[8D]