New Wave Outpost Forum

Couch potato drug. Mimics an aerobic workout without actually doing anything. Stimulates muscles to remove sugar from the blood which would be a good thing for diabetics. Not tested on humans yet, only on mice.

I'm a type 2 diabetic and this would be great except it will never be approved for human use. The powers that be (whoever they are) will shoot this down because of the amount of money that would be lost. Syringes, insulin, monitor devices and so on and so forth. It would put Wilford Bramley out of a job fer chrissakes! We can't have that happen.

While I'm on the subject, all those monitor device commercials on television freak me out. Don't get me wrong, diabetes is a serious thing but as long as you take your meds, eat right and exercise, you can control it. They make it out like if you don't constantly check your levels, you are going to die. I check my levels every other day (doctor's orders) and I'm happy to say that I'm doing great. It's all marketing if you ask me. Scare tactics to buy, buy, BUY! Give me a break. I've never even bought a monitor. My insurance company sends them to me as long as I participate in a phone survey. I have 2 unused units at home right now.

Take your meds, eat right and exercise and don't let Wilford freak you out.

My worry wouldn't be the pharmas...can you imagine the massive amounts of money to be made with such a drug? I'd think it would far outstrip the profits from the diabetes segment.

My worry would be disease potential. If Aicar works on stuff like the AMPK signaling pathway and either disrupts or enhances elements of it, you're talking about a lot of very chemically sensitive gene and protein targets. AKT proteins shown to play roles in various carcinoma cell proliferation as well as preventing cell death in melanomas. Changes in TSC proteins are shown to produce morphological changes in cells - you can imagine that may not be good for things like cardiac cells. Things like SRC can impact osteoclast formation and absorbtion - what might be the long-term osteoporosis effects.

Just saying not to get your hopes up immediately. Human biology is a bitch.

I echo Blir's statement concerning the financial potential of a drug like this--not only in patients with DM, but in any who is overweight. Believe me the holy grail for Big Pharma is not a cure for Breast Cancer or HIV, but a reliable and safe weight-loss drug. I don't have the biochem background Blir does, but from what I know of this line of drug investigation, it would have the potential to cause lipolysis in anyone--thus your true "fat burning" drug.

I think another concern is the possible safety issues with such a medication. Remember our true goal with treating DM is not to get someone's blood sugars under control, but to prevent the macrovascular (e.g. heart disease) and microvascular (e.g. kidney failure) complications that hyperglycemia plays a significant role in. IIRC these drugs would be similar in function to PPAR agonist drugs. The prototypical PPAR agonist (aiming to treat dyslipidemia) was pulled from the market before it even got started due an increased risk of heart attack in patients using them.

Finally, Max, recent data supports your contention that aggressive monitoring of blood sugars in DM 2 may not be beneficial:

Routine Self-Monitoring of Blood Glucose Counterproductive in Type 2 Diabetes

NEW YORK (Reuters Health) Apr 17 - Blood glucose monitoring by patients with type 2 diabetes not requiring insulin therapy provides no long-term health benefits and may in fact reduce patients' quality of life, according to two prospective randomized trials published in BMJ Online First on April 18.

A cost-utility analysis of self-monitoring based on data from the prospective Diabetes Glycaemic Education and Monitoring (DiGEM) trial. The study cohort included 453 patients with type 2 diabetes managed with diet or oral hypoglycemic agents alone, and who had an HbA1c level > 6.1%.

Subjects were randomized to usual care (n=152), less intensive self monitoring with advice to contact their doctor for interpretation of the results (n=150), or more intensive self-monitoring and training in interpreting the results (n=151). Patients in the intervention groups were instructed to measure their blood glucose levels three times daily on 2 days/week.

At 12 months, no difference was found in HbA1c levels between the groups after adjustment for baseline HbA1c levels. Responses to a health-related quality of life questionnaire revealed significant increases in the levels of anxiety and depression between baseline and the 12-month follow-up in the intervention groups.

Meanwhile, in the prospective Efficacy of Self Monitoring (ESMON) study, researchers in Northern Ireland compared outcomes among 184 patients with newly diagnosed type 2 diabetes randomized to self-monitoring or no monitoring. Those assigned to self-monitoring were asked to measure four fasting and four postprandial blood glucose levels each week.

Dr. Maurice J. O'Kane, at Altnagelvin Hospitals Health and Social Services Trust in Londonderry, and his team detected no significant differences between groups at any time during the 12-month trial in HbA1c values, episodes of hypoglycemia, or change in body mass index.

BMJ Online First 2008.

"Finally, Max, recent data supports your contention that aggressive monitoring of blood sugars in DM 2 may not be beneficial:"

Hey, my doctor seems to be up on this stuff....I used to check 3 times a day, 7 days a week making charts and graphs to present to him how I have been doing. When I showed them to him he told me to knock it off and test it twice a day every other day and quit obsessing on the graphs. "Eat right, take the pill twice a day and do some kind of exercise and you'll be fine". Been doing it for 2 years and have passed my physicals with no problems. My eye doctor said that there is no indication of any visual problems and this foot doctor I went to said the same (I have neuropathy) told me to check my feet daily for signs of cuts so no infections set in. To me it's no real big thing...I treat it like I have a cold and nothing more. Like doc said, quit obsessing and you'll be fine.

And thanks for the info you guys....we gots lots of brainiacs here at NWO.