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Q: Anybody feel like talking......really talking ?

Discuss hard-to-find or out-of-print New Wave and '80s Alternative, and share a few songs along the way.
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Q: Anybody feel like talking......really talking ?

Postby xymox970 » Fri Sep 17, 2021 6:44 pm

Hi guys.

OK.....I have a question.....and first, forgive me it this is directed at the wrong place on this particular forum, but I did not find what I was looking for at the General Discussion & 80s music forum topic, so I thought I try asking about it here first....

Here goes.....

Let me first say that I really really (as well as many others) appreciate the way Obscure Central has been functioning.....especially with fantastic contributions from members like - first and foremost Paul & Rissan (with their long running series) and lately bosnark and others who have started their own series and people who regularly actively contribute like Uvox & AJWave to share obscure / rare music from the decade we truly call our own......but that is not what I wanted to talk about.

Maybe I am mistaken, but I get the impression that there is really not that much of a discussion going on......not only here on Obscure Central, but also on General New Wave & 80s Discussions topic where I was originally hoping I could direct my enquiry....and thats basically it what I wanted to say.

Maybe its just me, but I really want to discuss 80s music at length with like-minded people, but when I took a closer look at the General topic over the last few years or so, there have really been very very few longer discussions over there. The average topic is open and practically closed - or laying dormant for a long time - after only a couple of replies. Since that part of the forum was opened in 2003, looks like there have been very few topics active for a longer period of time with periods of increased activity.
For example, a topic that has been started a couple of months ago and which I personally thought that was very well presented and thought out - with a deceptively simple title - What Is An Instrumental - from Passing Stranger, has unfortunately has only a few replies......which is a real shame and in the end - although someone initially might feel encouraged to add their personal perspective with a few examples thrown it - its very easy to be discouraged when faced with such a poor reply quota.

But really.....from my perspective.....it doesnt have to be anything specific.
Even at my age, I am still very curious about various aspects of 80s music and even the tiniest details / curiosities on specifics topics might bring a spark of joy to my heart.

So......if there are others out there - at this point in time - who feel they would like to discuss more......even, on first look about silly things like - why was no.68 the highest UK singles chart position that David Austins brilliant single Turn to Gold has ever managed to conquer in 1984. The same question could apply to classic ballads (IMHO) like Storm Of Light from Working Week (only reached no.88 in 1984) and generally speaking.....why some of those New Wave Classics - as we call them these days - never charted at all.....
How come Wayne Hussey changed three bands in the period from 1984-1986 and Robert Smith has done all three just in 1983/1984 ?
How come some of the people destined for greatness at first glance, like the Liverpudlian Paul Simpson never actually made it big ?
How come Andrew the lord Eldritch is still out there performing live after all these years (is he really ??), but still not managing (or wanting ?) to release a single new studio song in almost 30 years ?
How come some relatively obscure artists were so big during the 80s in the Phillippines (I found out about it relatively recently) and still have a cult following out there in certain cirles nowadays ?

I am a 50 year old single guy and music is truly the one great passion in my life that keeps me going, especially in these modern troubled times we live in.......actually, some people......like the late great Adrian Borland have called it the New Dark Age a long long time ago......maybe I am misinterpreting his lyrics, but it sure feels very familar ("too close to home....too near the bone") where I read those words written on paper.....40 years ago....

Final thought.......song lyrics.......is there a topic we can discuss those and those alone ?
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Re: Q: Anybody feel like talking......really talking ?

Postby eddie » Sat Sep 18, 2021 1:05 am

An excellent post raising many points.

Don't worry about which forum you have posted in because it's highly relevant to what you are saying. This forum has a lot of members and the vast majority never post at all and even fewer post in the discussion sections.

The most obvious point would be that this is not just a problem here but it is the way the internet has gone in recent years where forums have been overtaken by facebook, twitter and even discord.

Also there's no doubt a fear of ridicule from certain people for expressing an opinion which they don't agree with. There are a section of "fans" here who believe this is their personal playground and what they say goes. It's even been commented on more than once by others.

It appears to me that most visitors come here for the free content. They download, they go. They never take part in the discussion sections. I could, if I was so inclined, point you in the direction of one well known poster with hundreds of posts who has made less than five in the discussion threads. Now it's obvious why they are here because that is the way they work on all sites where they have a presence (to abuse the generosity of others) but there's no way they are alone.

I'm not sure there is an answer to your questions. There are some serious music discussion boards which might enable constructive discussion but this is not one of them.
Fuck's sake mate how do you manage all those usernames on guitars101 and greasy lake?
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Re: Q: Anybody feel like talking......really talking ?

Postby xymox970 » Sat Sep 18, 2021 4:19 am

eddie wrote:I'm not sure there is an answer to your questions. There are some serious music discussion boards which might enable constructive discussion but this is not one of them.


Eddie.....firstly, many thanks for your honest opinions and observations regarding this issue.
And secondly......I guess you have answered my question right there - in your own opinion.

And If you truly believe that is indeed the case with this forum / community.....I would like to ask you kindly if you could direct my attention towers those others serious music discussion boards you are referring to, because.....as I have said before......I would really really like to discuss music at length with like-minded people. As simple as that.
All I know of and can think about what exists and various artists pages and member boards for those artists where they probably do indeed discuss every singles detail of their respective careers, but that way one could theoretically join dozens, even hundreds of boards and jump from one to another as time would allow. There surely should be another place that would encompass all things 80s......including late 70s new wave period leading up the 80s like on this forum, where one could talk about and compare activities / releases from all those artists active during that time......

I tried on Soulseek....because at first, I thought, that should in theory be the ideal place to connect with someone very close to my own personal taste in music, including all the specific interests.....but it seems that even those kind of people on there (and there are quite a few of them) mostly only want to download and not ask any questions / give answers which eventually could lead to a very interesting conversation.....so I have kind of given up on that.


My music knowledge covers vast areas, but in its core its mostly confined to the period between 1981- 1993 and within the specific genres during that time , I could talk about any of them apart from heavy metal, hardcore and reggae.....more or less.....

Thank you.
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Re: Q: Anybody feel like talking......really talking ?

Postby xymox970 » Sat Sep 18, 2021 4:40 am

eddie wrote:The most obvious point would be that this is not just a problem here but it is the way the internet has gone in recent years where forums have been overtaken by facebook, twitter and even discord.



Firstly......I dont even know what discord is. :(
Second.....heard of twitter but never used it nor do I have the desire to, because as I understand it, its a system based on short messages.....and that is not what I am looking for.
Thirdly, I tried Facebook.....once......a couple of years ago I opened a false profile only to try to engage with people in a real conversation.
I have immediately connected hundreds of 80s artists to my profile (just to let people know what I am all about :) ).....even stated a new group called 80s instrumentals, but despite my best efforts got only a few half hearted replied and kind of given up on that afterwards.
Although Facebook can be a fun place to go to and check out all these links and quickfire information, the thing that bugs me the most about is of technical nature and that is the fact that is eats a lot of memory......so much that my poor computer couldnt really handle and started slowing down to a standstill after just a short term use.....
I have even bought a smartphone last year with that in mind, and it does work like a charm, but the problem is....I have a problem with smartphones and such small screens in general......I get a headache after just a short time reading the text and that makes it simply impossible to use for me. I guess thats my age acting up..... :)
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Re: Q: Anybody feel like talking......really talking ?

Postby xymox970 » Sat Sep 18, 2021 5:09 am

.....just two more examples of what I am after....

A couple of years ago I have fortunately stumbled upon a bought a book from Simon Reynolds called Rip It Up And Start Again - Postpunk 1978-1984.
Wow. This book is indeed worth its weight in gold IMHO.
The way the book is written is so informative and yet so engaging with apparently first-hand details about my and your favorite artists from the era I had no idea about.
Thanks to the book I have found out how Green from Scritti Politti started as part of the far-left Marxist commune (if I got that right), how he developed all his ideas within that group, made his musical DIY manifesto, suffered a near fatal heart attack more than 40 years ago and after all that did a complete 180 (U-turn), decided he wanted to become of part of the machinery, make pop music, have hits and become a star and made it just about perfect (IMHO) all and finally succeeded after all.......
And there are dozens and dozens of such interesting stories in that book......

The only trouble is....I have always been such a bad reader. Even when I find something so interesting and close to my heart, I cannot simply get my self to read the whole thing.....only bits by bits......

The other example can be found on Youtube.
There is this guy who has a really really good music channel who called himself The Professor Or Rock.

https://www.youtube.com/c/ProfessorofRock

He is familiar with all period of rnr history from the 50s onwards, but it seems that 80s is his favorite period and The Smiths his all-time favorite band.
But actually its not all this......there are plenty of channels and plenty of content out there with 80s in focus thats really hard to listen to and support because of the fact how lacking the presentation is and how half hearted and honestly uninformed / not really reasearched its all done.
This guy is however something else.
When he presents a certain song or a band profile and does the interview, not only is he very well informed about the subject matter, asks the right questions......but what impresses me the most is how passionate his views are and when he does his daily expose, how much love he really puts into it - you can actually tell that the guy really feels the music deeply that he talks about.

Its the real thing.

Although he does go into new wave subject matter very often, he rarely / almost never stumbles onto those New Wave Gems we so often mention here. Its still pretty much a.....let me call it a too general of a view of what new wave represents to an American music lover.

He did however once mention The Wild Swans - albeit only for a few seconds in a totally different context when talking about another song....... :D
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Re: Q: Anybody feel like talking......really talking ?

Postby eddie » Sat Sep 18, 2021 6:24 am

Yes I have the ebook of rip it up and start again, excellent stuff. And in a way I'm sort of like you I can only tolerate ebook reading in short bits and ebooks fail miserably when they try to recreate the big, photo heavy and superbly designed books.

And before anyone does, you can buy it, so show the author some respect and please don't post it here.

Youtube has lots of interesting documentaries, interviewers, presenters etc and so do the various podcast services. I watched a couple of people talking about B.A. Robertson on youtube last night, very interesting (I'll just pause a moment while someone goes off to zinhof to request BA's albums...la la la, nice weather we're having ..., back now? ok, moving on).

I seriously think that one thing you need to look for is forums where no download links are allowed. You could even start your own, it's very easy but again I would suggest that if you do then don't allow download links or they become the focus and don't allow requesting of links even by pm or in a roundabout way such as "I'm curious" or "has anyone come across". I think you would end up with a small but dedicated membership.
Fuck's sake mate how do you manage all those usernames on guitars101 and greasy lake?
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Re: Q: Anybody feel like talking......really talking ?

Postby xymox970 » Sat Sep 18, 2021 8:34 am

.....and finally......when I say talking, what I actually mean interacting with others, because I could ramble on and write excruciatingly long posts and my personal opinions and impressions about various subjects from the golden age of pop music.....circa 1983/1984.g.......but it would really be pointless unless someone were to react, answer, perhaps offer an interesting remark, even a different point a view and by doing so inspire me to answer back and continue the discussion......
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Re: Q: Anybody feel like talking......really talking ?

Postby eddie » Sat Sep 18, 2021 10:47 am

Just looking at the general discussion board, it's interesting that the topics appear to get the "views" (often more than a topic in this section does - except those which I seem to remember being told no one was interested in :) ) but they don't get the replies. As you said, I could write a huge reply on the Miles Copeland book but there seems to be little point.
Fuck's sake mate how do you manage all those usernames on guitars101 and greasy lake?
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Re: Q: Anybody feel like talking......really talking ?

Postby 80rulez » Sat Sep 18, 2021 11:00 am

Unfortunately as eddie mentioned, most message boards are replaced by social media.

This is the first one I join in a long time. The last forum that I actively participated was at least 15 years back.

@Xymox, I do watched several episodes of Professor Of Rock. I really like his shows. Highly recommended if you are 80s fans.

The other show I that enjoy was the VH-1 Band Reunited. That was awesome. Wish they can resurrect it again.
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Re: Q: Anybody feel like talking......really talking ?

Postby eddie » Sat Sep 18, 2021 11:13 am

Maybe the thread itself represents a minor answer. Just keep this going as a long, rambling, discussion?
Fuck's sake mate how do you manage all those usernames on guitars101 and greasy lake?
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Re: Q: Anybody feel like talking......really talking ?

Postby xymox970 » Sat Sep 18, 2021 11:55 am

....going a bit off-topic, let me address the Facebook issue on one more point....

From the very beginning where I first heard about the concept and its defining features, I really hated the basic idea of "LIKE" and "DISLIKE" buttons and what they actually stand for.

So....if I.....for example watched Siouxsie & The Banshees and their Swimming Horses performance on TOTP 1984 I had two options.
My first - and probably preferred options by the creators of this software - would be just to click on the LIKE or DISLIKE button to show my gut reaction, appreciation or disapproval.

But, If I in fact felt really strongly about something like that when I saw it, wouldnt the normal reaction - the normal way of expression my opionion be by writing my impression on the very thing that I had just seen......an opinion in my own words, coming directly from my heart - if the case in point would be something that touched me very deeply, like for example that particular song - my favorite of theirs......wouldnt that be the right way of going about this particular situation rather than just clicking the LIKE button ?

I dont know.....I am aware that could be a generational thing...... or on the other hand - it could be plain laziness on the part of many.....or another term that currently excapes me...... :D

BTW, i just just checked the video I was talking about - an absolutely beautiful song done absolute justice by replacing the lacking original audio from the studio and overdubbing it with the actual studio version - so you can enjoy the sound in perfect quality while watching the studio performance.
Interestingly enough, this wonderful video on you on youtube (you can easily find it), after more that 4 years in circulation currently has 9779 views, 282 thumbs up (equivalent to likes on facebook) and 2 thumbs down......BUT the most dissapoint fact about the whole thing that during whole that time the video has been uploaded, as it currently stands, it only has 17 comments altogether.....
So.....out of 284 people who watched the video (some perhaps only for a few seconds) only 17 of them thought that the actual song / performance deserves perhaps only the most basic of comments or that actually has something worth saying about it......
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Re: Q: Anybody feel like talking......really talking ?

Postby eddie » Sun Sep 19, 2021 12:09 am

Yeah the fascination for facebook is a mystery and along with youtube has killed off concerts as an experience long before covid turned up. A one minute portrait size facebook video shot on a phone or a shaky, blurry song on youtube have become 'proof' you were there and 'enjoying' yourself. This isn't an age thing, it's a fact. Imagine U2, Bowie or Queen at Live Aid with a sea of mobile phones.
Fuck's sake mate how do you manage all those usernames on guitars101 and greasy lake?
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Re: Q: Anybody feel like talking......really talking ?

Postby eddie » Sun Sep 19, 2021 8:06 am

Had an interesting experience earlier on with soundcloud. Interesting in terms of the amount of official material that gets posted and requested on facebook, youtube and here. I uploaded two, one song samples of uncirculated, completely unofficial soundboards by Bowie and Peter Gabriel both recorded with the artists knowledge and agreement but neither officially released or even bootlegged. My intention was they were there for one hour no more and I would delete both. Soundcloud beat me by about 59 minutes with the Gabriel one but the Bowie one stayed for the full hour until I deleted it when the people intended to hear it had done so.
Fuck's sake mate how do you manage all those usernames on guitars101 and greasy lake?
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Re: Q: Anybody feel like talking......really talking ?

Postby Passing_Stranger » Mon Sep 20, 2021 11:04 am

Interesting thoughts you have here, xymox! And, of course, thank you for the interest in instrumental topic - I had a thought it won't go into two digits re: replies for some time, but yeah, I kinda hoped for a bit more interaction anyway :D

Really it's not the time (hesitate to write "anymore", but that may very well be right) for abundant discussions. I have a feeling the best years of online talks were in late 1990s and 2000s and those are well and truly behind us. Even those damned social platforms experience dips in the number of content posted (both new posts and comments). Like people are more and more refraining from socializing (to the huge gain of TikTok and the like). So that may be natural in itself.

Besides, how many people really have anything interesting to say? I'm afraid online is a just reflection of offline, where you have to work hard sometimes to find people with whom to have a proper talk of any substance. Lots and lots of people either don't have any thoughts on any given subject or struggle to formulate their thoughts into anything coherent. And that's just a talk - online you have to write and we all know it's damn hard sometimes. Just look at YouTube, 90% comments at the very least are one-liners, often simply emojis. So sadly it's too optimistic to expect eloquent discussions most of the time.

Plus there are seemingly always people who make a place seem inhospitable. They tear apart conversations, troll, stalk, abuse etc, seemingly hell-bent on driving as many people as possible away. NWO's no exception. And if such people participate in a conversation most will prefer to stay away, not willing to be drawn into a slanging match. Internet is as harsh as reality in that aspect, often even more so.

I think good discussions may be found in specialist places, like certain blogs, for example. Post Punk Monk's one, I visit it often and recommend to all interested. I also like UK-Mix forum, especially the music chart section. I'm a big fan of historical charts and there are lots of the most interesting discussions, even to this day. Those places are just two that spring to mind immediately, maybe others can recommend more, I'll think about further examples too. So there's life "on the internets" still :D You just have to look closely to find it. Much like real life, really.
Last edited by Passing_Stranger on Tue Sep 21, 2021 1:12 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Q: Anybody feel like talking......really talking ?

Postby musfan » Tue Sep 21, 2021 12:06 pm

If Professor of Rock is too mainstream, you might want to check out some of the Trash Theory videos. They're not hitting the Rare Hits of the 80s / Gazebo Music level of obscure, but when they discuss popular songs, they often show links back to much lesser known songs, which is nice to see.
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